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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 14:42:52 GMT
My girlfriend sold her Mac on ebay before christmas. Someone bought it for £850, and came to collect it. Unfortunately, we didn't think to get them to sign for the pickup, meaning we have no documentation to prove this took place. Bugger.
The buyer has done a "chargeback" thingy through paypal, saying they haven't received the goods, and paypal have taken the money out of my girlfriends' account. We've been through the paypal procedures, stated our case, and the buyer's credit card company have decided to rule in favour of the buyer. Meaning we basically have no Mac, no £850, and an email from paypal saying the recommended next step is to contact the buyer directly to try and resolve the issue.
We will do this, and we'll try giving paypal a ring too, but I was wondering if anyone knew who we should really be trying to contact to get our money back. I don't really feel like being cheated out of £850 at the moment.
Anyone with any ideas or similar experiences?
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Post by coffers on Jan 24, 2007 14:53:13 GMT
The police, you have been conned, and I doubt if the buyer will be contactable now.
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Post by coffers on Jan 24, 2007 14:55:13 GMT
Paypal is a load of shoite as far as their security checking goes. I wouldn't trust it with a barge pole with anything of high value, cash deals only on such things, that way there is no losses from stopped or bouncing checks and stupid paypal rulings.
This is a case of theft pure and simple.
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Post by coffers on Jan 24, 2007 14:57:28 GMT
Do you have their address and is it their real address?
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Post by Mr Bismarck's Electric Donkey on Jan 24, 2007 14:57:36 GMT
Yes, this is theft and so the police is the next step. They may not appear too interested in doing something, but you'll have paperwork and the beginnings of a trail of evidence and a trail of action, (of you doing something), to put in front of a court if you end up there.
But speak to the police and give them the details and see what they suggest.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 14:58:44 GMT
I will never trust paypal with such a thing again. To be honest, I don't think I would have done this time, only Ellie thought it would be ok and had put it on there without even discussing it with me.
As far as contacting the police goes - what will they actually do about it? Is it even worth it, for £850? If we get a crime number from them, would we be able to claim on insurance? I suppose that depends on our insurance policies - we just have house contents insurance at the moment, with Endsleigh.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:00:19 GMT
Coffers - all we have is a hotmail email address... :moop:
Police it is, then, and we'll see what they say.
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Post by Mr Bismarck's Electric Donkey on Jan 24, 2007 15:04:56 GMT
I think, ultimately, you're going to be out a Mac, but if the police will accept it as a crime and give you a crime number, you may be able to claim it from insurance. Do you live near a shop or next to an NCP Car park?
If the person who bought it is from a long way away and you have CCTV of them in your street on the day you say collection took place, then you have something. It might sound far fetched, but a lass here at work had an almost identical situation and the guy had parked in front of a jewellers a few doors down. She sweet-talked the owner, got the tape of the front of the shop for the day in question and hey presto, said naughty man changed his story and coughed up the money.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:14:06 GMT
Unfortunatley, there are no shops or car parks or anything near us. The guy who picked it up said he'd come from Birmingham, and we have a hotmail address, as I say, and that's the only stuff we've got to go on.
It's a ridiculous state of affairs - we completely trusted the whole system, and had no idea that this kind of thing could happen. It's particularly gutting as we were selling the mac to try and pay off some debt. Ha, fat chance of that.
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Post by Moo on Jan 24, 2007 15:14:23 GMT
Much ouchness, Boo.
I think first port of call is the Police, as others have said. I also have the same fear that Stu has in that I wouldn't hold out much hope for anything.
eBay should have contact details for the buyer though. I seem to think that you must provide an address to register with them. Maybe you could contact eBay and see what they say too.
*edit*
Also, did the winning bidder have a history? Nic is always wary of people without a bid history. If they do have one, you may be able to try and contact some of the other eBayers they have been in contact with to see if there are any addresses they have sent stuff to.
Worth a shot anyway.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:26:22 GMT
Ellie's filling out an online non-emergency crime report, on the police website, as I speak.
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Post by Mr Bismarck's Electric Donkey on Jan 24, 2007 15:27:31 GMT
PayPal will have an address for the buyer, which you should be able to see by going into the transaction in Ellie's paypal site. It would probably help to have that when you contact the police.
I suspect they're going to look at it as a she-said/he-said situation, as they've no actual proof which one of you is telling the truth, at first glance, but if they give you a crime number, it'll be worth approaching your insurance company.
Also, make sure you write a letter of complaint to both EBay and PayPal. The former will tell you they're sorry, but it's out of their control and the latter will tell you they have made their decision, but you want these things on record, on paper. Or via email. Make sure you request read receipts for emails or use at least recorded delivery for snail mail.
Check out the buyer's reputation on EBay. If they haven't left you negative feedback, then it begs the question why not, if they haven't got a laptop they bought from you? Don't point that out to them, just keep it in mind.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:28:31 GMT
Moo - no, I don't think they did have a history. Again, I didn't know this when the Mac was picked up - I trusted Ellie that she knew what she was doing, and it seems she trusted these buyers implicitly.
Fookin' trust, eh? If I'm not careful, I'm going to turn into Coffers and not trust my own left hand.
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Post by Moo on Jan 24, 2007 15:29:05 GMT
Who is the buyer?
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:30:51 GMT
Cheers, s1ut - all passed on and taken on board.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:34:59 GMT
The buyer was: jaha123kaur
They have one feedback, which is from Ellie. It seems to be positive feedback, thanking them for the immediate payment. I've asked her to change this feedback....
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Post by Mr Bismarck's Electric Donkey on Jan 24, 2007 15:36:37 GMT
Oh and when/if you go to your insurance company, don't say "I've done something silly" because an insurance company's first responsibility is to its share holders, so it will look for ways to avoid giving you any money. Just say "I've had my Mac stolen, here is the crime number." When they ask for the details of what happened, tell them someone bought the Mac from you and then reclaimed the funds, leaving you without the goods or the payment. Continue to stress the police have given you a crime number for it. ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png)
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Post by Mr Bismarck's Electric Donkey on Jan 24, 2007 15:38:32 GMT
The buyer was: jaha123kaur They have one feedback, which is from Ellie. It seems to be positive feedback, thanking them for the immediate payment. I've asked her to change this feedback.... Sadly, you can't change feedback once it's left and can only withdraw it if it's a mutual withdrawal, for which you'd have to get jaha123kaur's agreement...
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:40:01 GMT
Nice stuff, stu. I knew you'd come good on this one. I really am a little wet behind the ears when it comes to shit like this. That's what I get for living a sheltered life for 27.5 years, I guess.
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 15:40:26 GMT
The buyer was: jaha123kaur They have one feedback, which is from Ellie. It seems to be positive feedback, thanking them for the immediate payment. I've asked her to change this feedback.... Sadly, you can't change feedback once it's left and can only withdraw it if it's a mutual withdrawal, for which you'd have to get jaha123kaur's agreement... Yeah, Ellie just told me that too. Ah well...
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Post by Moo on Jan 24, 2007 15:45:46 GMT
Not wanting to sound like the doom merchant here, but as this was their first feedback, i would say this is a bogus account, Boo. Deffo get a crime number from the police, I think this is the only way forward.
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Post by Moo on Jan 24, 2007 15:50:08 GMT
Also, I have just noticed that that person was registerd on the same date they bought the item.
This was a while ago too, how come this has taken so long to crop up, Boo?
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Post by coffers on Jan 24, 2007 15:56:09 GMT
Even if you had left negative feedback, they would have just grabbed another hotmail address and set up another ebay user.
Sadly there are only 2 safe ways to accept payment in this country:
1. CASH, as long as it isn't forged and 2. CHAPS payment
Bankers Drafts can be easily forged, electronic BACS payments can be recalled, Credit card paymnets as you have found out can be recalled, Cheques can be stopped or bounce.
CHAPS payments cannot be recalled, they are typically used for high value payents and cost a fair whack to do (anything between £15 to £50 depending on how nice your bank is.
Hopefully your insurance company will cough up and not make too much of a song and dance about it. If the police decide to get off their arse and follow it up, rather than aim speed guns at your car, they will probably find the online companies reluctant to give out any details to them anyway.
FXD that it gets sorted out. Oh and pester the police eerynow and then asking how the case is going, giving them the crime number. They have been known to close cases to keep theire solved stats up, even though they have no intention of solving the case unless it falls into their lap and says "here I am,".
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Post by Moo on Jan 24, 2007 15:58:07 GMT
Good shout about the reminders, Coffers. :thumb:
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Post by Boony on Jan 24, 2007 16:18:19 GMT
We have a crime number, it's a crime of deception, apparently. Next stop, insurance company.
I guess we should pay paypal the money owing on Ellie's account, though. Even though I really don't want to.
The reason this has taken so long is that paypal were investigating the situation - from mid november until now, I think. They've just given us their verdict (we owe them money), when I was hoping they'd sort it out in our favour. So now we're trying our best to sort it out from our end. But, we have a crime number, so the insurance company may well pay out.
Which would be nice, as I really don't want to spend £850 from my ISA to help Ellie out...
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